Fantastic and all so true. This needs to be tacked on the entrance to the next synod on synodality, if that ever happens again. Maybe send to all our aging progressive clergy and especially bishops. They have it all completely wrong and for far too long. Enough is enough.
Thank you, thank you, thank you so much for this. I read this when it originally ‘aired’ and had sent it to family members, but now will take this opportunity to send them your recording - impress upon their minds, thereby “doubling down” on this wonderful message. Come home, this says, to your One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic faith! Thank you, Dr. Kwasniewski, for all you do for us!
I would only suggest that what he means to say is traditional Catholicism as unfortunately the modern church remains largely and tragically wrapped up in the trappings of the modern world.
I wonder how well Catholics from other countries would respond to this argument. I have a hard time thinking that a return to the Latin or traditional Mass would be meaningful to my friends in Nigeria, or the Catholics I knew in the Middle East. I do not believe that Pope Leo XIV will move in this direction after he spent years in Peru. This viewpoint seems provincial in a post-colonial, post-modern world.
In point of fact, the TLM is celebrated with thriving congregations in over 90 countries at present. The main reason it has not grown in popularity is that it was brutally suppressed nearly everywhere, and even congregations that seek it have been stymied at every turn. There is no doubt that Africa, where the Faith grew at a much faster rate under the "Tridentine Catholicism" of the missionaries, would respond to it even better than they do to the liturgy imposed on them by European intellectuals with preconceived notions of Africanness that sometimes border on racial stereotyping.
It is possible that Google AI is wrong, but your claim that "over 90 countries" celebrate the Latin Mass seems high. "Latin Masses are celebrated in various other countries, but their numbers are smaller compared to the US, France, and Canada. The Latin Mass Directory lists countries with Latin Mass celebrations, noting that 63 out of 195 countries have some form of the Latin Mass." Given the very rapid growth of Catholicism in Nigeria between 1965-2020, and the flourishing parishes in that country led by Nigerian priests, your claim about the modern Mass being imposed upon Nigerians by European (and American?) intellectuals strikes me as arrogant. I personally found the Catholic church in Nigeria inspiring, and the recent martyrdom of so many Catholics indicates the faith's strength.
I will look into the number of countries, you may be right about that and I had the wrong number in mind.
But as for Africa, I have done the research, and the book to which I linked includes a detailed study by a Nigerian of the way in which Western liturgists changed the nature of African Catholic worship, not as requested by the people, but as configured for them by Europeans. If you want the scholarly citations for it, you'll find them there.
I spoke with Joseph Shaw, president of the International Federation Una Voce. He says there are at least 70 countries with the TLM if one counts the SSPX as well as the "regular" groups. So, I take back my earlier number, but the larger point remains: wherever the TLM has established itself, it has become quite popular - and this, not internet griping, was the "evil" that brought down the hammer of Pope Francis and Co.
"How, in this age of deconstruction and digital nihilism, could the Church of hierarchy, ritual, and confession be considered—of all things—cool?"
Two premises I reject. Cool and cultural rebellion. Cool represents a fad. Cultural rebellion, a disagreement. First, it isn't cool, it is an embrace of Reality. In this Reality it isn't rebellion, it a rejection.
As an Eastern Orthodox Christian my opinion might be negated right from the racer's chocks, but I believe that good Catholicism is neither cool, or a cultural rebellion. It is an embrace of the Triune God in a relationship whose Truth(s) trancends the mere stubble of this present existence.
As an Eastern Orthodox Christian, I also believe that the Early Fathers expressed this Relationship in a coherent belief structure that is obedient to the Trinity, the Church and to Holy Scriptures.
I have read and seen many godly Catholics do this down through the ages to our present time.
I agree with your entire description. Where I think you go wrong is in not understanding the rhetorical trope the author is using. He is playing with the idea of "cool" and "rebellious" but of course it is only those things accidentally; as he explains, people are turning to the faith because it is true and beautiful, timeless. The language to which you object is clearly meant here as tongue-in-cheek.
I really enjoyed this article although I’m not seeing what the author is seeing in terms of return to church by the young. In my diocese, the young go to evangelical Christian rock churches. I’ve been there too and I like the brightness of it and the coolness of it but it’s not a church. I like candles and statues and quiet.
I attended Latin masses when very young. I wouldn’t mind trying one out but here’s the bottom line, if a persons heart is not open to Jesus, any form of church may cause an initial jolt but that will wane.
People need to find Jesus in their heart, then it won’t matter where they go to church or don’t go.🙏
I do think that with Jesus in the heart, there is all the more reason to try to find a church and a form of worship that is most pleasing to Him and most reflective of all that He is.
Fantastic and all so true. This needs to be tacked on the entrance to the next synod on synodality, if that ever happens again. Maybe send to all our aging progressive clergy and especially bishops. They have it all completely wrong and for far too long. Enough is enough.
Thank you, thank you, thank you so much for this. I read this when it originally ‘aired’ and had sent it to family members, but now will take this opportunity to send them your recording - impress upon their minds, thereby “doubling down” on this wonderful message. Come home, this says, to your One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic faith! Thank you, Dr. Kwasniewski, for all you do for us!
I would only suggest that what he means to say is traditional Catholicism as unfortunately the modern church remains largely and tragically wrapped up in the trappings of the modern world.
Agreed. I think it's evident Mac Ghlionn is describing traditional Catholicism but he suggests it more than stating it outright.
Deo Gratias!
I wonder how well Catholics from other countries would respond to this argument. I have a hard time thinking that a return to the Latin or traditional Mass would be meaningful to my friends in Nigeria, or the Catholics I knew in the Middle East. I do not believe that Pope Leo XIV will move in this direction after he spent years in Peru. This viewpoint seems provincial in a post-colonial, post-modern world.
In point of fact, the TLM is celebrated with thriving congregations in over 90 countries at present. The main reason it has not grown in popularity is that it was brutally suppressed nearly everywhere, and even congregations that seek it have been stymied at every turn. There is no doubt that Africa, where the Faith grew at a much faster rate under the "Tridentine Catholicism" of the missionaries, would respond to it even better than they do to the liturgy imposed on them by European intellectuals with preconceived notions of Africanness that sometimes border on racial stereotyping.
For more, see:
https://osjustipress.com/products/is-african-catholicism-a-vatican-ii-success-story
It is possible that Google AI is wrong, but your claim that "over 90 countries" celebrate the Latin Mass seems high. "Latin Masses are celebrated in various other countries, but their numbers are smaller compared to the US, France, and Canada. The Latin Mass Directory lists countries with Latin Mass celebrations, noting that 63 out of 195 countries have some form of the Latin Mass." Given the very rapid growth of Catholicism in Nigeria between 1965-2020, and the flourishing parishes in that country led by Nigerian priests, your claim about the modern Mass being imposed upon Nigerians by European (and American?) intellectuals strikes me as arrogant. I personally found the Catholic church in Nigeria inspiring, and the recent martyrdom of so many Catholics indicates the faith's strength.
I will look into the number of countries, you may be right about that and I had the wrong number in mind.
But as for Africa, I have done the research, and the book to which I linked includes a detailed study by a Nigerian of the way in which Western liturgists changed the nature of African Catholic worship, not as requested by the people, but as configured for them by Europeans. If you want the scholarly citations for it, you'll find them there.
I spoke with Joseph Shaw, president of the International Federation Una Voce. He says there are at least 70 countries with the TLM if one counts the SSPX as well as the "regular" groups. So, I take back my earlier number, but the larger point remains: wherever the TLM has established itself, it has become quite popular - and this, not internet griping, was the "evil" that brought down the hammer of Pope Francis and Co.
"How, in this age of deconstruction and digital nihilism, could the Church of hierarchy, ritual, and confession be considered—of all things—cool?"
Two premises I reject. Cool and cultural rebellion. Cool represents a fad. Cultural rebellion, a disagreement. First, it isn't cool, it is an embrace of Reality. In this Reality it isn't rebellion, it a rejection.
As an Eastern Orthodox Christian my opinion might be negated right from the racer's chocks, but I believe that good Catholicism is neither cool, or a cultural rebellion. It is an embrace of the Triune God in a relationship whose Truth(s) trancends the mere stubble of this present existence.
As an Eastern Orthodox Christian, I also believe that the Early Fathers expressed this Relationship in a coherent belief structure that is obedient to the Trinity, the Church and to Holy Scriptures.
I have read and seen many godly Catholics do this down through the ages to our present time.
I agree with your entire description. Where I think you go wrong is in not understanding the rhetorical trope the author is using. He is playing with the idea of "cool" and "rebellious" but of course it is only those things accidentally; as he explains, people are turning to the faith because it is true and beautiful, timeless. The language to which you object is clearly meant here as tongue-in-cheek.
I have a tendency of seeing the 'black & white'. Thank you for the course correction.
I really enjoyed this article although I’m not seeing what the author is seeing in terms of return to church by the young. In my diocese, the young go to evangelical Christian rock churches. I’ve been there too and I like the brightness of it and the coolness of it but it’s not a church. I like candles and statues and quiet.
I attended Latin masses when very young. I wouldn’t mind trying one out but here’s the bottom line, if a persons heart is not open to Jesus, any form of church may cause an initial jolt but that will wane.
People need to find Jesus in their heart, then it won’t matter where they go to church or don’t go.🙏
I do think that with Jesus in the heart, there is all the more reason to try to find a church and a form of worship that is most pleasing to Him and most reflective of all that He is.
Thanks. Church provides community too and that’s another huge reason to go, however, as we all know, one hour per week doesn’t cut it.
Prayers, meditations and Christian actions every day are preferred 🙂
Brilliant, succinct and powerful. Thank you 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻