Excellent post, Dr K! And very timely. What we do not want is for Pope Leo to see the bitter, nasty traditional Catholics who give the TLM a bad taste in the mouth. In other words, a real turn~off. I have met some of them, and I run away from them ~ and I am a TLM lover. I always admire the guy in my previous parish who doggedly, but always kindly, pushed for the TLM (along with others) till we finally got permission to hold a weekly TLM. He might have been frustrated at times, but he never showed it. He was always kind and good natured and sacrificial with a deep understanding he could express simply, and it won people over.
Although in my experience liberals tend to be overall more judgmental, harsh, and petty than trads, I have definitely encountered toxic trads in person. They do serious harm to the faith.
The lay faithful in Charlotte should open up their homes to the Mass. They should aggressively protect whatever priest is willing to offer it. They should aggressively promote their Mass on social media and whatever other channels are available to them. And if said bishop says anything about it they should tell him what he can do with his illegal decree.
No more of this "I'm a loyal son of the Church" garbage as an excuse for tolerating the lawlessness of the current members of the hierarchy.
Googling the address cited in the bishop's letter, it appears the "yet to be determined" chapel actually does have a name: Freedom Christian Center, a protestant church!
Seriously? The faithful of Charlotte need to stand up and demand a CATHOLIC venue for the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. (You know, maybe like the parishes where it has been celebrated up to this point...) Relegating the TLM to a protestant chapel is totally unacceptable.
This is outrageous. The days of asking permission are over. It is time to assert our absolute and inviolable right to worship as Catholics have always worshipped
It sounds like the diocese will renovate it for $700,000, but it won't be finished by July 8. That is quite a sum to "further ‘promote the concord and unity of the Church’ among the People of God in the Diocese of Charlotte."
We'll see. Thank you for clarifying. I do have my doubts though about the future if you keep letting yourself get restricted when they have no right to restrict you. Because in a year and a half or two or three years this 'chapel' may well be gone too. At some point we have to figure out what is the most important thing and focus on that and not worry about them.
I guess the problem many of us feel is a sort of guilt over our rebellious (but very often justifiably so) feelings. After the trauma of the last decade, we're LARPing the reality we want into existence and trying to play act and manifest the perfect pontificate we want into reality as compensation for subtle guilt over being "an opposition" to the Pope.
The middle state of loyalty to the Church and to the Vicar of Christ, even while opposing many of his actions, is such a hard place to be in psychologically, like trying to love a family member while fighting with them, that many of us can't take it.
Some take the "easy route" in the rightward direction of angrily flipping off the Pope (and to some degree the papacy indirectly) of sedevacantism. Others flip out to the left into "Popesplaining" or should I say "neo-Popesplaining," claiming that Leo XIV is the "most based Pope ever" or something of that sort, that clearly is not supported by the facts either.
St. Catherine of Sienna's middle prudent position is hard to stay in for anyone not as holy as she was. But it's also where we're called to be.
The psychological pull (especially when I'm also trying to get into writing on these topics and write satire on them as well) is extra strong. The pull to merely criticize (and end run) into some sort of denial of Pope Leo XIV's validity would allow me easy writing, easy readership growth, and friends. So also would joining the Popesplainers.
But doing neither, "covering one's father's nakedness" whilst not ignoring it as a problem, is the hardest, as you have no easy answers and no easy and simple fix for the Church as a whole, other than of course, whatever you can, beginning with professing truth as publically yourself as you can.
It occurred to me that we are now facing a Rorschach Pope™ (reflective of the test created by Herman Rorschach in 1921). In the test, a series of inkblots were shown to subjects, asking them to explain what they saw in each. Their answers were used to map out their emotions and psychology. I make no brief for the validity of the test, but have discovered it was the test used most widely in the 1960's (of course). According to Wikipedia, "It has been employed to detect underlying thought disorder, especially in cases where patients are reluctant to describe their thinking processes openly."
This present tedium is only to be expected, for Vatican II is the ultimate Rorschach Council™, in which members of the Church are invited to distinguish what the documents mean, with trads and conservatives looking at the words (some more than others) while more the liberal elements lean into the "penumbra." I don't mean to compare vestments to inkblots, but we're reduced to grasping at such straws (the mozzetta, the colour of his shoes, Cubs vs White Sox) because we cannot count on the guardian of the Magisterium to guard the Magisterium. Like most at this point, I'm cautiously optimistic, but not expecting him to pontificate firmly about any contested teaching--at least not for the time being. For this week, at least, we can weigh the dismissal of Cardinal Paglia from one dicastery with the appointment of a woman to oversee clergy and call it a draw.
Exhausting, unless one simply keeps his head down and prays. Like mad.
It would be a good start for Pope Leo XIV if he would just stop the crack down and removal of the TLM which is ongoing. The sooner he does that the better and it will give us all confidence that he is going to be at least a reasonable Pope. Surely he can see that the removal of the TLM is a form of persecution against the only part of the Catholic Church that is growing.
The way we worship is of such profound importance … it says who we are, day after day, week after week, year after year, century after century. The church has been brought to its knees by 55 years of an abysmal liturgy, that has told us anything goes when it comes to doctrine, morality, Catholic identity along with art, music and architecture.
TLM Catholics are the only hope for the future for the ‘Vatican II Church’ is dying as a result of its woeful liturgical practise.
With regard to how is Pope Leo XIV going, at least he is obviously not a psychopath. Francis clearly was. There is indeed a need for Catholics to take heart and ‘let him be pope’ while we get on with our task, which is to love God, worship Him in sincerity and truth and to love our neighbours as ourselves. I’m nearly 76 and haven’t really made a lot of progress on any of that, to be honest, so in the time I have left I won’t be letting the Pope distract me.
Great advice here. I have decided to pretty much ignore what the Pope says on a daily basis, while still praying for him every day. I am definitely adopting a medieval peasant mentality; recently I have been reading a history of the Popes and, quite frankly, the only explanation of how the Church has survived with such venal men at the helm is God. None were perfect - all, like all of us, were sinners and the balance sheets of good/bad at the end of their lives are very variable. I will continue to travel from my diocesan desert to the ICKSP Mass, wait and pray for the tide to turn. My home diocesan parish will continue to dwindle as the current attenders (mainly elderly women) die and are not replaced. It's God’s time, not ours and, as you say, it's time to focus on growing our faith and spiritual life, not making statements on social media. We are entering a time of change in our societies as well as the church, when the post war consensus is ending and a new world will emerge. We should put our energies into that, I think, making Christianity and especially Catholicism a major feature. That will influence the future more than getting angry on Twitter.
There is a PS to my earlier post about the magnificent mover and shaker of my old TLM church who is so kind to both supporters and detractors. He’s also a power house. Because he has led the TLM with wisdom and care and utter selflessness, the community showers the TLM with money, unasked for. He just told me this morning that they have been able to buy a magnificent set of sacred vessels from Poland recently, suitable for a cathedral ~ all worthy of Our Lord’s sacred body. People like him can move mountains and change hearts. The poor NO pastor of the church is tearing his hair out with bewilderment since he can hardly get sufficient funds to keep things going despite the far greater numbers of parishioners. But the TLM group, in their abundance, shares what they have.
Stay true and continue traveling on this road full of pot holes. Even if you are driving a tank, it will break some springs, but with God's Grace you will active the destination, bringing with you many souls that was lost. Regarded this " I have learned by long experience that you can never please everyone. Whatever you say, there will be opponents to either side" We must remember, ; Even Jesus didn't please all, the oponentes cruscified Him. May God's will be upon you! 🙏 If wasn't for the grace of God, there's I!
Excellent post, Dr K! And very timely. What we do not want is for Pope Leo to see the bitter, nasty traditional Catholics who give the TLM a bad taste in the mouth. In other words, a real turn~off. I have met some of them, and I run away from them ~ and I am a TLM lover. I always admire the guy in my previous parish who doggedly, but always kindly, pushed for the TLM (along with others) till we finally got permission to hold a weekly TLM. He might have been frustrated at times, but he never showed it. He was always kind and good natured and sacrificial with a deep understanding he could express simply, and it won people over.
Thank you also for the Tan books mention!
Although in my experience liberals tend to be overall more judgmental, harsh, and petty than trads, I have definitely encountered toxic trads in person. They do serious harm to the faith.
Agree.
The lay faithful in Charlotte should open up their homes to the Mass. They should aggressively protect whatever priest is willing to offer it. They should aggressively promote their Mass on social media and whatever other channels are available to them. And if said bishop says anything about it they should tell him what he can do with his illegal decree.
No more of this "I'm a loyal son of the Church" garbage as an excuse for tolerating the lawlessness of the current members of the hierarchy.
Googling the address cited in the bishop's letter, it appears the "yet to be determined" chapel actually does have a name: Freedom Christian Center, a protestant church!
You can see what it looks like here: https://www.google.com/maps/@35.6076362,-80.8021723,3a,55.3y,15.25h,93.69t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1spdIeS42PYjgExRSn2cQzgg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D-3.6899999999999977%26panoid%3DpdIeS42PYjgExRSn2cQzgg%26yaw%3D15.25!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDUyMS4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D
Seriously? The faithful of Charlotte need to stand up and demand a CATHOLIC venue for the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. (You know, maybe like the parishes where it has been celebrated up to this point...) Relegating the TLM to a protestant chapel is totally unacceptable.
This is outrageous. The days of asking permission are over. It is time to assert our absolute and inviolable right to worship as Catholics have always worshipped
More info here: https://catholicnewsherald.com/90-news/local/11679-latin-mass
It sounds like the diocese will renovate it for $700,000, but it won't be finished by July 8. That is quite a sum to "further ‘promote the concord and unity of the Church’ among the People of God in the Diocese of Charlotte."
We'll see. Thank you for clarifying. I do have my doubts though about the future if you keep letting yourself get restricted when they have no right to restrict you. Because in a year and a half or two or three years this 'chapel' may well be gone too. At some point we have to figure out what is the most important thing and focus on that and not worry about them.
I guess the problem many of us feel is a sort of guilt over our rebellious (but very often justifiably so) feelings. After the trauma of the last decade, we're LARPing the reality we want into existence and trying to play act and manifest the perfect pontificate we want into reality as compensation for subtle guilt over being "an opposition" to the Pope.
The middle state of loyalty to the Church and to the Vicar of Christ, even while opposing many of his actions, is such a hard place to be in psychologically, like trying to love a family member while fighting with them, that many of us can't take it.
Some take the "easy route" in the rightward direction of angrily flipping off the Pope (and to some degree the papacy indirectly) of sedevacantism. Others flip out to the left into "Popesplaining" or should I say "neo-Popesplaining," claiming that Leo XIV is the "most based Pope ever" or something of that sort, that clearly is not supported by the facts either.
St. Catherine of Sienna's middle prudent position is hard to stay in for anyone not as holy as she was. But it's also where we're called to be.
The psychological pull (especially when I'm also trying to get into writing on these topics and write satire on them as well) is extra strong. The pull to merely criticize (and end run) into some sort of denial of Pope Leo XIV's validity would allow me easy writing, easy readership growth, and friends. So also would joining the Popesplainers.
But doing neither, "covering one's father's nakedness" whilst not ignoring it as a problem, is the hardest, as you have no easy answers and no easy and simple fix for the Church as a whole, other than of course, whatever you can, beginning with professing truth as publically yourself as you can.
Exactly. Thanks for your comment, James!
It occurred to me that we are now facing a Rorschach Pope™ (reflective of the test created by Herman Rorschach in 1921). In the test, a series of inkblots were shown to subjects, asking them to explain what they saw in each. Their answers were used to map out their emotions and psychology. I make no brief for the validity of the test, but have discovered it was the test used most widely in the 1960's (of course). According to Wikipedia, "It has been employed to detect underlying thought disorder, especially in cases where patients are reluctant to describe their thinking processes openly."
This present tedium is only to be expected, for Vatican II is the ultimate Rorschach Council™, in which members of the Church are invited to distinguish what the documents mean, with trads and conservatives looking at the words (some more than others) while more the liberal elements lean into the "penumbra." I don't mean to compare vestments to inkblots, but we're reduced to grasping at such straws (the mozzetta, the colour of his shoes, Cubs vs White Sox) because we cannot count on the guardian of the Magisterium to guard the Magisterium. Like most at this point, I'm cautiously optimistic, but not expecting him to pontificate firmly about any contested teaching--at least not for the time being. For this week, at least, we can weigh the dismissal of Cardinal Paglia from one dicastery with the appointment of a woman to oversee clergy and call it a draw.
Exhausting, unless one simply keeps his head down and prays. Like mad.
Idk how much rohrschach this can get
https://gloria.tv/post/zmNmBxcvAeMD4e6zHoHmaahAr/
It would be a good start for Pope Leo XIV if he would just stop the crack down and removal of the TLM which is ongoing. The sooner he does that the better and it will give us all confidence that he is going to be at least a reasonable Pope. Surely he can see that the removal of the TLM is a form of persecution against the only part of the Catholic Church that is growing.
The way we worship is of such profound importance … it says who we are, day after day, week after week, year after year, century after century. The church has been brought to its knees by 55 years of an abysmal liturgy, that has told us anything goes when it comes to doctrine, morality, Catholic identity along with art, music and architecture.
TLM Catholics are the only hope for the future for the ‘Vatican II Church’ is dying as a result of its woeful liturgical practise.
With regard to how is Pope Leo XIV going, at least he is obviously not a psychopath. Francis clearly was. There is indeed a need for Catholics to take heart and ‘let him be pope’ while we get on with our task, which is to love God, worship Him in sincerity and truth and to love our neighbours as ourselves. I’m nearly 76 and haven’t really made a lot of progress on any of that, to be honest, so in the time I have left I won’t be letting the Pope distract me.
Great advice here. I have decided to pretty much ignore what the Pope says on a daily basis, while still praying for him every day. I am definitely adopting a medieval peasant mentality; recently I have been reading a history of the Popes and, quite frankly, the only explanation of how the Church has survived with such venal men at the helm is God. None were perfect - all, like all of us, were sinners and the balance sheets of good/bad at the end of their lives are very variable. I will continue to travel from my diocesan desert to the ICKSP Mass, wait and pray for the tide to turn. My home diocesan parish will continue to dwindle as the current attenders (mainly elderly women) die and are not replaced. It's God’s time, not ours and, as you say, it's time to focus on growing our faith and spiritual life, not making statements on social media. We are entering a time of change in our societies as well as the church, when the post war consensus is ending and a new world will emerge. We should put our energies into that, I think, making Christianity and especially Catholicism a major feature. That will influence the future more than getting angry on Twitter.
There is a PS to my earlier post about the magnificent mover and shaker of my old TLM church who is so kind to both supporters and detractors. He’s also a power house. Because he has led the TLM with wisdom and care and utter selflessness, the community showers the TLM with money, unasked for. He just told me this morning that they have been able to buy a magnificent set of sacred vessels from Poland recently, suitable for a cathedral ~ all worthy of Our Lord’s sacred body. People like him can move mountains and change hearts. The poor NO pastor of the church is tearing his hair out with bewilderment since he can hardly get sufficient funds to keep things going despite the far greater numbers of parishioners. But the TLM group, in their abundance, shares what they have.
This is the way it always has been and ever shall be. To God be the glory!
Amen!
Dr. K, when does the TAN book sale end?
I asked, and was told: "Sunday night. Probably midnight."
Thank you!
Stay true and continue traveling on this road full of pot holes. Even if you are driving a tank, it will break some springs, but with God's Grace you will active the destination, bringing with you many souls that was lost. Regarded this " I have learned by long experience that you can never please everyone. Whatever you say, there will be opponents to either side" We must remember, ; Even Jesus didn't please all, the oponentes cruscified Him. May God's will be upon you! 🙏 If wasn't for the grace of God, there's I!